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Keith Rivers Signing is "Imminent", Will Harvey follow?

Our friends over at Pro Football Talk are reporting that Keith Rivers is on his way to Cincinnati to sign his contract and join his team in camp.  This completes the slotting process, with both picks on either side of Derrick Harvey under contract and in camp.  The Jacksonville Jaguars must be waiting with great anticipation to see the numbers from the Rivers contract to determine if the market is continuing it's shift toward the absurd, or if it sets a reasonable "bottom end" of Harvey's range.

This game of chicken between the Jaguars and Harvey still has no end in sight, but this will eliminate some of the wiggle room from both sides.  CAA, Condon and Kremer, the firm and agents that represent Harvey will have less room in what to ask for, just as the Jaguars will have the bottom ranges of their offers cut off.  One would think that this would be encouraging news, but in a standoff like this you never really know.

Frankly, I'm pissed off at everyone involved in this situation.  The New York Jets and New Orleans Saints broke with the league and turned the 6th and 7th draft picks into "top five" in terms of money.  The Jaguars knew full and well when they traded up into the top 10 that the money would be ridiculous, especially with talks of a rookie cap getting more and more attention.  Derrick Harvey, actually, is low on my list of annoyances.  He's a young guy with a career that can end on any given snap.  It's not his fault that the market is well past the point of absurdity and there's not many of us out there who would turn down millions of dollars, no matter how good of a teammate we may be.

It's not Harvey's fault that because of the Jets and Saints, Harvey's likely guarnteed money could be greater than or equal to David Garrard, no matter how easy it is to hate on him for the coincidence.

The Jaguars want to make a point, CAA want's to keep their reputation, and Derrick Harvey is sitting in a hotel room practicing with chairs.  He's already falling behind in the teams plan for him this season, and now with Rivers signing, there's no excuse to be the last guy unsigned. 

With the bottom and top of the range set, finding a reasonable middle ground should happen quickly.  Once ego and pride get into things, as the Jaguars and Kremer are giving me the impression that they're negotiating for more than just Harvey in this case.

Your thoughts?

-Chris

0 recs  |  Comment 21 comments

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Say goodby to Mike Peterson

If the Jaguars sign Derrick Harvey to anything close to what he is asking, that salary will come from the other players on the team. The most vulnerable is Mike Peterson. At $5mil a year and in the last year of his contract, he would most probably be a casualty of Derrick Harvey. His bid for a new contract will fall on mother hubbard’s ears. Sorry, Mike, nothing left in the cubbard.

I’d have to look at the team salary chart again to see who else will fall, but make no mistake, there is not room for Derrick Harvey at $10mil a year and the rest of this team. The money comes from somewhere and there will be casualties. This could be a make or break decision point on the future of our team.

by Tkopa on Aug 5, 2008 5:01 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Certianly in the realm of possiblity...

Though Mike Peterson is likely to leave the team next year anyhow, the Jaguars are very happy with their young corps developing at linebacker, and giving Mike Peterson big money might not be in the cards to begin with.

I’ll tell you this, I don’t think Harvey’s contract will make or break the teams bank, they had to have an idea of what a top ten pick would cost, even a 15% increase over Anderson’s contract is about 17 million in Guaranteed money.

-C

Big Cat Country!:: The Official Home of the Unofficial Blog of the Jacksonville Jaguars!

by River City Rage on Aug 5, 2008 5:09 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Man, you know that's right...

The big problem with all this ’ rooks making dough’ thing is that these teams all think that with an upcoming NO CAP year, all of these problems will work themselves out. Tell that to the guys with contracts lower than they believe to be fair. They will come for your money, all you owners, believe it.

It scares me as a football fan…..sure smells like the end of the NFL as we know it.

To be master of oneself and never waiver in ones resolve.
- Maximus Desimus Meridius

by jagsrock on Aug 5, 2008 6:36 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Signing Harvey

There is really no one to blame here. Harvey is entitled to get as much money as he possibly can. The Jaguars, understandably, need to protect their salary structure. Someone has to “stop the madness” and it may as well be the Jaguars.

As far as Mike Peterson, was he really going to be re-signed anyway? With the Jaguars depth at linebacker, I didn’t see that happening. “Make or break decision? Come on, Harvey isn’t THAT good. Groves can get the job done.

by StormBunny on Aug 5, 2008 5:07 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

It's far more fun...

To blame the Jets…

But you’re right, neither side is operating under “evil” intentions, Agents have one job, maximize contracts. It’s unpleasant, but part of life. I wish Tom Condon would negotiate my next contract…

-Chris

Big Cat Country!:: The Official Home of the Unofficial Blog of the Jacksonville Jaguars!

by River City Rage on Aug 5, 2008 5:12 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Make or break financially

OK I got carried away. But if hard decisions have to be made over letting people go due to salary, our team begins to unravel. The money available to pay is fixed and the team finances can only support so much.

If Derrick Harvey signing forces quality players out and Derrick isn’t that good, we are back to 8-8 that quick. That is the make or break, the financial ramifications.

by Tkopa on Aug 5, 2008 5:13 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

yup....you're on the right track.

To be master of oneself and never waiver in ones resolve.
- Maximus Desimus Meridius

by jagsrock on Aug 5, 2008 6:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The holdout creates pressure.

It puts pressure on the Jaguars to pay more than they wished so they don’t look like the scrooges of the league.

It puts pressure on Harvey to perform at a high level and prove he was worth the headache.

And ultimately, it puts pressure on the fans to buy tickets so the franchise can afford the players’ bloated salaries.

Thanks CAA.

Unfortunately, the truth only comes out game-by-game.

by arthardie on Aug 5, 2008 5:28 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

The pay expectations have a damaging effect

Hester recently signed a reported four-year, $40 million contract, a deal that didn’t go unnoticed by Cribbs.

“I couldn’t help but notice,” Cribbs said with a smile. “I was happy for him. He deserved every bit of it. He’s a great talent and it’s good to see another returner get his pay.”

Schaffer would not comment specifically on Cribbs’ demands or negotiations.

by Tkopa on Aug 5, 2008 10:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Who needs him?

Jags need to stand their ground. I would much prefer Peterson be rewarded for his play and talent than to see harvey cash in on an absurd rookie salary trend. The Jags should make a fair offer based on 5-10% increase over last years draft and leave the table. If harvey wants to play he will sign, if not he can sit out the year and make half that the next year.

by copper904 on Aug 5, 2008 6:16 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I miss the days when...

the offer was not based on a percentage increase of last years #8 pick. It use to be that if you played at a position the team deperately needed, you “got paid”. If you were one of their options, don’t look for Wells Fargo to drive up. Now, I personally think the Jags are going to ‘move on’ like Jack said. And when they do, Harvey will end up having to sign for much less than he thought.

Everybody sing it with me,  " THAT'S LIFE, AND I CAN'T DENY IT,........"

To be master of oneself and never waiver in ones resolve.
- Maximus Desimus Meridius

by jagsrock on Aug 5, 2008 6:44 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Someone should point out...

That because Harvey is lucky enough to have been drafted by a team in Florida, his income-tax burden on that money will be significantly less since there’s no state income tax. In Georgia, we’re talking about a 6% state income tax. When you’re talking about $30-40M, that’s some serious savings.

by pksiv on Aug 6, 2008 3:27 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Harvey contract.

“the Jaguars and Kremer are giving me the impression that they’re negotiating for more than just Harvey in this case”

How about nothing less than the future of the league? The Jaguars know that there has to be an end to giant contracts for unproven talent. I’m sure they knew they were in for trouble when Harvey hired Leftwich’s agency to represent him.

With most of the league going nuts with these contracts someone had to be the one to say ENOUGH. My hope is that the Jags will be that team. The Jaguars are my team and no single player is more important than the team. Would Harvey help? Maybe, hopefully, but there is no guarantee.

So to the Jaguars I say, get em boys. Somebody call the kid on the phone directly and tell him that while we would love to have you on the field we are NOT going to pay you more than David. Let him know that if he wants to sit out the season and take his chances next year in the draft then that is fine by us.

As a fan of this team I want them to do the hard thing. Tell Harvey to have fun in the hotel and good luck finding a loan for that Hummer he wants because unless he gets his tail on the field then he can wait until next year ans see if he get’s drafted 8th overall.

by demagogue on Aug 6, 2008 3:33 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

Derrick Harvey will think these things

At first comes the realization that he won’t get $20mil guaranteed or close to Sedrick Ellis money. Then he will begin to wonder what else he could lose. Then the pre-season games will start on TV. Keith Rivers couldn’t take the pressure anymore and wanted a deal done and it happened.

When Derrick wants to play football he will make the call. He won’t sit out the year and take his chances next year. The teams before us have coaches on the hot seat and are desperate. They are reaching for hope in the draft. Jack Del Rio and James Harris have not an ounce of desperation and Wayne Weaver is a fair and good businessman.

Pick up the phone Derrick, $15 mil is waiting for you. But then again, maybe you could wait them out a little longer, prove how tough you are. As Paul Spicer said “welcome to the business end of football”.

by Tkopa on Aug 6, 2008 4:48 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Unfortunately...

I think the only think Harvey can do now to get anywhere near the money his agent was hoping for is to wait it out… hoping that one of our other DE’s gets injured. Sad but true. Right now, that’s the only thing that will strengthen his bargaining position.

by pksiv on Aug 7, 2008 11:05 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

That is

probably an accurate assessment of his position but it should not have gotten this far. As things stand the Jags are quite happy with the guys they have. I think that they would love to have him but right now they see him as nothing more than a second or third string player.

You do not give third string players 18 million dollars in guaranteed money.

It will be interesting. As I said, I will be proud of the Jags if they hold the line. I will also be quite happy for them to reach reasonable compromise in line with the NFL’s previous average increase from the #8 pick last year. This year is an anomaly and the teams that paid massive increases over the previous year’s draft were desperate to fix their teams with one guy or start new as Atlanta is doing. There is no need for the Jags to give in.

As Tkopa said, Wayne is a fair man. He will make a fair deal. I am not a fair man. I would make my next offer lower than my previous one. It’s probably a good thing that Wayne owns the team rather than me. :)

by demagogue on Aug 7, 2008 4:23 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

The more this goes on....

the more I think we have a head case on our hands. I am getting very concerned about Derrick Harvey’s attitude and actual worth to this team. Football players can’t stay off the field this long. There is no real reason for this holdout, it proves nothing, it gains liitle and risks a lot. This is almost a career suicide we are witnessing.

Someone please tell me I am wrong.

by Tkopa on Aug 7, 2008 8:34 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

Our Preseason

starts Saturday night. I really expected this to be done before that. Evidently nobody told Harvey that the reason the Jags jumped so high to get him is because they did not think anyone would be available at 26. Had they know Groves was going to be there then they probably would not have made the jump.

So the Jags draft two guys to do a similar job. The extend Spicer to give them depth and experience. If Harvey is fool enough not to sign before tomorrow night and during that game Groves makes some plays the Harvey will become even more of an afterthought.

I like Harvey and wish him the best but his first mistake was the agent he hired. I would love to blame the agent for all of this but at some point Harvey has to realize that he is hurting himself.

I can’t wait for the game. Go Jags.

by demagogue on Aug 8, 2008 11:34 AM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

no pressure

There is now no pressure on the Jags. Practice will go on, pre-season will go on, and the Jags have all but convinced Harvey in his head he won’t be playing football this year. Can you imagine that…. 5 million this year or nothing. Most people will not make that in their life time. Granted it’s not that high with taxes, fines, NFL requirements, duel housing, but it’s a chunck of change and he is a poor college kid. His family will pressure him for the money, right now someone is calling him a fool for not signing. Listen to Jack and the management, “we’ll adjust, defense is looking good, Groves is looking good, getting ready for the season… Derick who?

Mark my words, he will be signed within 3 weeks, and not for what that pimp, Kremer is asking (oh the ugliness!). The Harvey camp will cave and it will be Harvey doing the caving.

by Jaghomer on Aug 7, 2008 9:13 PM EDT reply actions   0 recs

This is why

University of Florida TE Cornelius Ingram, a star player, tears his ACL in practice. This is why Harvey (and all other draft picks) try and get every dollar possible as quick as possible. Their careers can be over very quickly. Lets try to not be so hard on Harvey at this point. There is a point of diminishing returns, of course, when you are holding out this long. The Jaguars are playing hardball and I respect that. But Harvey is not a bad guy. When he finally does put on the teal and black and puts Peyton Manning on his butt for the first time, all will be forgivin.

by StormBunny on Aug 8, 2008 10:24 AM EDT reply actions   0 recs

I agree about paying players

I do understand that players get hurt and if they can make money they should. All of that makes sense and is something I agreed with for years.

However there is a point of common sense, to know when the negotiating game is over. Derrick Harvey can hold out forever if he wants, but sooner or later he actually hurts himself. I think he is at that point now. The Jauguars are not going to suddenly jump $2mil a year. In fact, the longer he waits, the less he is worth. This is the indication I am pointing out. At some point people walk away and Derrick losses a lot more than he would gain by this behavoir. We are watching a self-destruction in progress.

by Tkopa on Aug 8, 2008 10:39 PM EDT up reply actions   0 recs

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