Unsustainable Success In Jacksonville
Any team can win a game. It goes hand-in-hand with that "Any Given Sunday" mantra. The good teams win more games than they lose and great teams win consistently. With that in mind, where are the Jacksonville Jaguars and why?
The Jaguars are an average football team. Jack Del Rio's tenure has been marked by roller coaster type seasons. One year the team over achieves and then the next year they fail to meet expectations. Del Rio's record illustrates my point, his record since taking over the Jags in 2003 is 51-48 with a 1-2 mark in the playoffs.
There are few franchises that are truly great. I will use the reigning Super Bowl Champion Pittsburgh Steelers as an example. The Steelers have been owned by the Rooney family for decades. It's a family business where one generation is not only expected but honored to take over the franchise. Majority owner, Dan Rooney is carrying the torch for his family and whenever he decides he cannot oversee administration of the franchise the next Rooney will step into his shoes.
The Jaguars have a very good owner in Wayne Weaver. He believes in the city of Jacksonville and even though he's in a small market and doesn't have the money that other franchises do he isn't afraid to spend for players he think can help his club. He lets his scouts do their jobs and the coaches theirs. He isn't an owner you'll see on the sidelines constantly over the shoulder of his head coach.
Although ownership is just one facet of a successful franchise. The scouting department is crucial to a team's success because the NFL Draft is a team's lifeblood. Keeping with the "The NFL Draft is a team's lifeblood" theme the Jaguars needed a transfusion. Their failures in the first round are awful. Those wasted draft choices are those of James "Shack" Harris, the former personnel director for the Jags. The Steelers on the other hand have hit on most of their first round draft choices. The most important man in the Steelers organization that you've probably never heard of is Kevin Colbert. Colbert is the Steelers Director of Football Operations. He's basically the head talent evaluator and has a lot of pull on draft day. When looking at Pittsburgh's recent draft you can see Colbert does his job very well. Speaking of the draft I think it's only appropriate to look at how a consistent winner drafts compared to a team that is floundering around .500.
We'll examine the first round of three drafts spanning from 2003 to 2005 involving the Jaguars and Steelers.
2003: The Jaguars drafted Marhall quarterback Byron Leftwich seventh overall. Seven years later Leftwich is on his third team competing for a starting spot in Tampa. In that same draft the Steelers struck gold with USC's Troy Polamalu at the sixteenth overall spot. Polamalu has become one of the league's best defenders and is well on his way to a Hall of Fame career. The Steeler's safety is widely regarded as one of the best at his position, if not he best and has been an integral part of Pittsburgh's two Super Bowl titles in the past five years.
2004: The following year the Jaguars passed on Miami (OH) quarterback Ben Roethlisberger because they had just drafted Leftwich the year before. Instead of selecting the best available player the Jags selected with the ninth pick of the draft Washington receiver Reggie Williams. Williams went on to play five mediocre seasons with the Jaguars. Williams was a huge reach and has had multiple run ins with the law and remains currently unsigned by any team. Roethlisberger fell to the 11th pick and was selected by the Steelers. The story could end there but then I'd be leaving out Big Ben's incredible rookie year where he garnered Rookie of the Year honors. In his second season Ben led the Steelers to their first Super Bowl win in almost thirty years and in 2008 he won a second Lombardi Trophy, giving the Steel City its sixth, making the Steelers the only franchise with six Super Bowl titles.
2005: The Jaguars opted to go with former Arkansas quarterback and work out wonder Matt Jones. Jones posted off the charts Combine numbers and flashed at the Senior Bowl making former Jacksonville personnel director James Harris make the quarterback turned receiver the 21st overall pick. The Steelers sat and waited for Virginia tight end Heath Miller to fall to them at the 30th spot. Miller was in the Jaguars' sights but his back injury and non-participation at the Combine scared the team off. What makes this pick even harder to swallow is Andy Heck, the Jags assistant offensive line coach at the time, was Miller's position coach at UVA and probably knew him better than any other coach in the country.
So there it is. One team, the Jaguars, wasted three consecutive draft picks. It doesn't matter if Byron Leftwich turns his career around somewhere else, he was a bust for the Jaguars. Williams and Jones were perennial disappointments on and off the field. In that same span the Steelers drafted two players that are looking like future Hall of Famers in Troy Polamalu and Ben Roethlisberger. The third player, tight end Heath Miller, has become a very good tight end that could garner Pro Bowl consideration in coming seasons.
The next thing to consider is does the team have a head coach that is capable of taking the team to the playoffs and to the Super Bowl? You have to admire the Steelers consistency, they've only had three coaches since 1969. Chuck Noll, Bill Cowher and now Mike Tomlin are the select few that have led the Black and Gold onto the field. The Steelers ownership believes in patience and letting a coach find his own way to win. Noll yielded four Super Bowls, Cowher won one and Tomlin, in only his second year, has won another. The Rooney family knows coaches are going to have down seasons and they understand that a good coach can get his players to play hard for him no matter the dearth of talent on the team. In their 15 years of existence the Jaguars have had two coaches, Tom Coughlin for the first eight seasons and Jack Del Rio since 2003. Coughlin got a young, expansion team to fight and play hard. Del Rio took the reigns after Coughlin was let go after multiple losing seasons. Since Del Rio has been in charge the team has been a tough, physical bunch but their effort has been less than 100% all the time.
That raises the question, Is Del Rio the right coach to lead the Jaguars to the playoffs consistently? Frankly his two playoff appearances in six years wouldn't be tolerated in other cities. His background as a former linebacker and fiery personality has sometimes led to riffs with players. When comparing Del Rio to his Pittsburgh contemporaries, Cowher and Tomlin, Del Rio falls short to both. JDR, like Cowher, is a former linebacker. Where Del Rio seems to fall short is he doesn't always keep his personal feelings out of team matters. Cowher knew how to motivate and get the most out of his players. In the past Del Rio has often seen his team give half-hearted efforts. Third year coach Mike Tomlin never played in the NFL but he worked his way up through the defensive coaching ranks. Tomlin brings exuberance that only a young coach can but there's also a calmness to him and a business-like approach that is usually only seen by veteran head coaches. Del Rio seems to lack the composure and sometimes the maturity that a "leader of men" to paraphrase Jack's words should have.
In Del Rio's defense the fact that James Harris blew three consecutive first round picks has hurt the talent on the team. I mean those are three players that should be building blocks for the franchise and each should be in the prime of their careers, so those busts of first round picks do sting. I will say at least owner Wayne Weaver made a smart move in promoting Gene Smith into the exalted position of general manager. Smith, unlike Harris, understands how you build a team. Smith won't sacrifice character for talent. Smith also understands how you build a team, up front, not by drafting receivers that were reaches in the first place.
With a good owner in place and a promising young GM the Jaguars have the front office to be successful. The question now lies with Weaver and Smith, Is Del Rio the coach that can take the Jaguars to the next level? We've seen the up and down stuff from Del Rio's teams and we're growing tired of it. Patience is a virtue as the Rooney family has proven but sometimes you have to know when to cut and run from a losing situation.
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62 comments
Comments
great article man
i still believe that del rio is the guy…and can be for years to come…i just hope that our front office changes didn’t come to late in his career…
by jlana24 on Jun 17, 2009 9:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Very good post! (Maybe deserve to be frontpaged!?)
I think Del rio can lead the defense, and a guy in Koetter’s caliber can run the show on offense. With Gene Smith as GM, I’m sure the talent will come. All Jack need is teach. If this drafted guys shows talent, and the jags can have 2-3 drafts like this, maybe the Jaguars will be a role model franchise, like the Steelers are now!
by Zoltan from Budapest on Jun 18, 2009 7:19 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I agree
Great comparison. We also have owned the Steelers recently, but they have owned the playoffs so….
Regardless, I think the coaching has finally settled where it needs to be. This is the beginning of something great.
but to be fair to the cynical approach, how long until greatness? should we wait?
Dear America,
You have too little patience. Let’s just sit and watch. This year is locked in. It really will be better. Remember how close jacksonville was last year. I believe it was the first 5 games that were lost by 7 points or less.
Once again, great article
LateRoundPick.com
by Surteal on Jun 20, 2009 5:30 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
don't blame it on Del Rio
I’ve been saying that Shack Harris was a mistake & a joke since they brought him here. The worst GM in all of football. He didn’t hit on 1 first rounder in the 6 yrs he was here and spent Wayne Weaver’s money on free agents like Obama spends our tax dollars. Don’t blame the 3-headed monster either, because when there was disagreement among the 3 they went in another direction and clearly you can see a difference in philosophy between Gene Smith, JDR and Shack Harris so there was always disagreement in the draft room forcing the Jags to draft a different player than either Gene or Jack wanted.
by jagsrealist on Jun 18, 2009 8:08 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I think
its 80% on shack since he was the GM and 20% on JDR because they were forced to agree on each choice. As for worst GM, i think it’s pretty clear that while we had a real bad GM shack wasn’t the worst. That honor goes to Matt Milan, ex-Lions GM.
"HULU: An evil plot to destroy the world. Enjoy"
by TheTealDeal on Jun 18, 2009 8:38 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ol' Jack
The people are gunning for you. You better get this defense turned around. Nice post, JJ.
Vox Veritas Vita...
by viator on Jun 18, 2009 8:32 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I should clarify something.
I’m not trying to lead the charge against JDR. There are aspects of him that I do like but overall I’m starting to sour on him as a head coach. Six years later, I’m still not sure if he’s a good head coach or a glorified DC. I’d like to think the former but he seems to have so many lapses that a good head coach shouldn’t.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 18, 2009 8:34 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
agreed.. however
I am on the same page with you.. I would like to see more consistency, sign of a good coach. However, I think that the huge fluctuations we have had can be directly attributed to Shack Harris and the weak character of the players he selected. They sometimes showed up and at other times showed their coach the finger.
It was Shack’s job to find a replacement for Jimmy, he did not. It was his job to find a left tackle that can protect the QB, he did not. In fact, most people forget that even leading up to 2007, Del Rio was still jostling for more control over personnel and as soon as he got it… his first move was to cut Leftwich and promote Garrard. Can anyone possibly second guess that move? A head coach should not have to do these types of maneuvers to try to get the right players on the field and Weaver realized this and adjusted beautifully. Don’t you think?
Now Del Rio can actually focus on coaching and not worry about fixing up after Shack’s horrible first round picks and even worse FA signings. In fact, when you put things into perspective… you have to wonder how we even had a winning percentage with Shack calling the shots. JDR might deserve more credit than we might want to give him. Only time will tell and thus I am behind JDR for the next two years. One year is not enough to turn this thing completely around.
by keepitreal on Jun 18, 2009 11:41 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Agreed.
If the team shows marked improvement (3-4) games worth then I think Jack should be given another year. But of they continue this underachieving garbage then Jack should and could be feeling the heat. I firmly believe the rest of the pieces are in place. This team has a good owner and I think a very sound general manager.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 18, 2009 1:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I like this article
it shows the polar opposites of our draft and theres. Now we have to recover
"HULU: An evil plot to destroy the world. Enjoy"
by TheTealDeal on Jun 18, 2009 8:35 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
I'm a big fan of JDR
I really believe that with Gene Smith handling personnel decisions, Del Rio will be able to coach. Gene is all about bringing in quality character guys. One of the biggest problems last year was Porter and that he and a couple of other players no longer here were the reason for the locker room issues. From what I’ve heard, Jack had nothing to do with signing Porter and he didn’t even know about it until after the deal was done. That was all Shack. Would we be having this conversation if the locker room problems never happened and we went 10-4? Nope. So, I say give Del Rio the players and he’ll succeed.
by JagHack on Jun 18, 2009 10:11 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Things that make me go hmm.
Some of the trouble that we have had has to be placed on JDR, but not all of it. The majority is on Shack. Shack was one of the most incompetent GM’s ever to grace an NFL team. With this in mind JDR was having to do his job and Shack’s. With Gene in place JDR should be able to now focus on coaching
by jesusjagfan2009 on Jun 18, 2009 5:53 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
100% correct
"HULU: An evil plot to destroy the world. Enjoy"
by TheTealDeal on Jun 19, 2009 9:33 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Bingo
When people tell me the Jaguars are a team “In the top third of the NFL” I roll my eyes. We’ve had two great years, one good year, and abunch of mediocre years.
"The worst kind of non-smokers are the ones that come up to you and cough. That's pretty cruel isn't it? Do you go up to cripples and dance too?"-Bill Hicks
Currently Playing:
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by FSBlueApocalypse on Jun 18, 2009 10:57 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
But we are
In the top third of the NFL as far as winning percentage over the last 15 years.
by JagHack on Jun 18, 2009 11:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
MIssed Opportunities
The Steelers have really capitalized on the Jaguars’ missed opportunities. I won’t blame them for the Leftwich pick. He was, at the time, thought to be a solid player worthy of a top-ten pick, and the new regime needed a replacement for Brunell.
The next season, however, they pass on Big Ben and the Steelers capitalize with two Super Bowls. After that, they’re constantly trying to find “weapons” on offense that don’t pan out. I’m curious to see how Brady Quinn performs in Cleveland to know whether or not passing on him twice was smart or not. Last year (Harvey) was a mistake also, because there were quality players drafted where the Jaguars could have picked without the trade up.
Shack was always thinking that they were “one player away.” That can never happen in the NFL, though.
by acedarney on Jun 18, 2009 3:28 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yep
you either got it or ya don’t
"HULU: An evil plot to destroy the world. Enjoy"
by TheTealDeal on Jun 18, 2009 4:05 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
well
we will see what happens. Gene has showed that he has a brain in his head so far
by jesusjagfan2009 on Jun 18, 2009 5:55 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
There weren't many DE's
to draft last year. And I think the best DE’s are fairly even in Chris Long and Harvey. Hey at least we didn’t draft Gholston. lol
I think the Big Ben non-pick is only bad in hindsight. Heck there is a good chance we wouldn’t have Garrard right now if we drafted Ben because DG would have been the 4th QB behind Lefty, Brunell, and Ben. And some would say, “well who cares if we don’t have Garrard if we have Ben.”
Well first of all Ben would have to beat out Lefty which would have been difficult considering Lefty had a year of seasoning before him. And something tells me that Lefty probably looks better than Ben in practice being that Lefty is a pocket passer. And without a crazy 4th QTR comeback from Ben I think he would have a hard time beating out Garrard after Brunell got cut. And if we are running the ball well and playing good defense I have a hard time picking Ben over Garrard because Garrard protects the ball better.
by Ewdtrey on Jun 18, 2009 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I more or less agree.
I also don’t get the people who are calling Derrick Harvey a bust. This is his second year, and that’s a little quick to judgment in my opinion.
by Kbot on Jun 19, 2009 2:19 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
They didn't need to trade up though
Derrick Harvey could turn out to be a really good player (and I hope he does). I was just saying that several quality players were available after number 8. There were 6 tackles taken between 8 and 26 in the first round last year, all of which will be starting this year. Imagine who we could have picked up with those three other picks also used in the trade.
by acedarney on Jun 19, 2009 10:30 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And I would rather have
Monroe ahead of all but Clady. I don’t think Duane Brown and Matt Baker will very good next year.
by Ewdtrey on Jun 19, 2009 4:50 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Clady
Could easily be a perennial pro bowler for the next ten seasons.
If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik
by Bestjagfan on Jun 19, 2009 9:13 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Amen to that!
Other than Michael Roos, Ryan Clady was the best OT in the AFC last year.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 12:15 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
And We Passed on Him...
If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik
by Bestjagfan on Jun 20, 2009 10:32 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Yea.
Put that one on James Harris’ tab.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
2008's DE class
was probably the most underperforming class based on where most of them got picked. I mean Gholston looks like a total bust, Harvey was a little slow to perform, (not judging yet), and i think Long just did average at times.
"HULU: An evil plot to destroy the world. Enjoy"
by TheTealDeal on Jun 19, 2009 9:35 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Garrard did not protect the ball better
In fact, that was his main knock prior to the offseason that Dirk Koetter was hired: he threw too many interceptions. If he hadn’t improved so much in that particular offseason, Garrard would not have won that job (we’d still be fighting over Leftwich vs. Garrard). Brunell isn’t even in the picture because he was already on his way out. It would have been a battle between Leftwich, Roethlisberger, Garrard and Gray.
Also, Ben would have had plenty of chances to display his ability to play in the 4th quarter because Leftwich was injured pretty frequently.
by acedarney on Jun 19, 2009 11:10 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Absolutely GREAT ARTICLE - man you nailed it big time!!!!!
One other thing to add to the JDR question. Not only has his teams been very inconsistent from year to year – our divisional record flat out sucks during his tenure as well. You can legitimately say that his divison record has been consistent for the past 4 seasons at 2 – 4.
If you can’t beat your division rivals, you probably won’t go very far IF you make playoffs.
Excellent points about draft busts. The JDR question needs a big time light shining on it.
Again – FANTASTIC ARTICLE – great job!
by OGN on Jun 19, 2009 11:07 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Much Thanks.
I was thinking of his divisional record and you are correct, it stinks. Jack doesn’t have a single winning record against any divisional opponent. I distinctly remember either after the end of 07 or 08 in his end of the year presser Jack said the team must do better in the division. Well, I’m still waiting.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 19, 2009 4:21 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You do realize there hasn't been football since the '08 season right?
If it was the ‘07 season, that’s only one season ago. I think you can keep waiting, these things usually don’t happen in one season, and he can’t really improve his record in the offseason. It takes time.
by Kbot on Jun 19, 2009 8:18 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Where are you coming from?
I’m just saying Jack doesn’t have a winning record against any divisional opponent. He’s had six years, not one, not two, not three, but six. I know it don’t happen in one season, I think what Jack meant was he was considering his divisional record since he came here in 2003 and he recognized you can’t win the division or make the playoffs consistently when you can’t win division games.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 19, 2009 9:11 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That's totally fair.
I’m just saying you’re taking Del Rio’s words a little out of context. I agree that he needs to improve his division record, but it’s not like he’s had all that much to work with. Defense only matters as long as the offense can score points. I don’t understand why people are lobbying to have him fired. With the exception of last season’s record, he’s been a pretty good coach.
by Kbot on Jun 19, 2009 10:46 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Out of context?
How? He said they need to be better in the division. (Period. He wasn’t ambiguous.) Defense doesn’t matter if the offense can’t score? Tell that to the Baltimore Ravens…a defense Del Rio knows quite well. I’m not lobbying anything, I’m saying his teams have been up and down. Do we all remember the Green Bay win in 04 followed by absolute egg at home to Houston where the playoffs were on the line? Jack is a decent coach, I’m not sure I’d go any farther than that at this point.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 12:18 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
Yes, defense doesn't matter if the offense can't score.
Considering the Ravens were ranked 11th in the league in points per game last year with 24.1 pts/g. I think a better team to support your statement would be Pittsburgh, but they scored 21.7 pts/g. Meanwhile, Tennessee scored 23.4 pts/g. Those are the top three scoring defenses in 2008. I prefer defensive football, but I’m realistic enough to realize that it doesn’t matter if a defense can hold every opponent to 0 pts if the offense can’t score. They’re both equally as important. I prefer defensive football because it’s more appealing to me, but the reality is that the team has to score more points than the opponent, which requires both defense and offense.
As for Del Rio’s comment, yes, I think you’re taking it out of context. Just because he says he wants to improve our record against divisional opponents doesn’t mean it will be immediate, and your comment certainly sounds that way. I apologize if I misunderstood you, but, “well, I’m still waiting,” sounds very much like it was supposed to happen ten years ago. With that in mind, I think we have the same opinion of Del Rio, considering decent and pretty good, by definition, are the same thing.
by Kbot on Jun 20, 2009 12:43 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It wasn't just 2008.
The Ravens offense has stunk for years. So yea they “couldn’t score” but they won games and made the playoffs. Baltimore won a lot of games 13-10, because defense mattered and the offense “couldn’t score”.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 1:12 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I think that's the general perception, but the numbers don't back that up.
In 2005, Baltimore had the 10th ranked scoring defense at 18.7 pts/g, and the 25th ranked scoring offense at 16.6 pts/g. Needless to say, they ended with a 6-10 season. In 2006, Baltimore was 1st in scoring defense at 12.6 pts/g, and 12th in scoring offense at 22.1 pts/g. Their record for that year was 13-3, and lost to the Colts. In 2007, their scoring defense was ranked 22nd at 24.0 pts/g, while their offense was ranked 24th with 17.2 pts/g. Their record for 2007 was 5-11. What this all means is that you need both to win, and hopefully one area can cover for the other. It doesn’t matter if the defense can hold everyone to 7 pts/g if the offense can only put up 6 pts/g. They’re both equally as important. To answer you, no, they couldn’t make the playoffs when they couldn’t score.
by Kbot on Jun 20, 2009 7:42 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Who cares who said what - JDR's total record vs divisional opponents stinks - period.
And, although I like JDR, I’m beginning to question IF he is a good coach. His teams are inconsistent and he has a lousy record against divison rivals. We;re not talking about ONE bad season, I’m looking at his ENTIRE body of work and after 6 seasons, it does leave something to be desired. That’s the fact – Jack!
by OGN on Jun 20, 2009 10:01 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Thank You!
It’s that simple. Jack Del Rio vs. AFC South = Stinko
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 10:09 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
FYI on divison record - it is very consistent
2003 2-4
2004 2-4
2005 4-2 (playoff year – lost 1st round)
2006 2-4
2007 2-4 (playoof year – 1st round win / 2nd round loss)
2008 2-4
That’s a combined 14 – 22 vx disional opponents
by OGN on Jun 20, 2009 4:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Ha
Consistency isn’t always a great thing.
If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik
by Bestjagfan on Jun 20, 2009 6:47 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You know what else he's consistent in?
Starting from the 2004 season, the Jaguars ranked second in the division for four years, until last year. Versus AFC South, he’s only behind Tony Dungy, and that doesn’t exactly stink. Especially considering Dungy’s overall record at Indianapolis is .759, one of the highest in history. Meanwhile, his overall record over his first six years is .521, while Dungy’s first six is .563. Over a 16 game season, that’s half a win more per season, not exactly a huge difference. Lastly, Bill Belichick, that guy averaging .708 winning percentage up in Boston, had a .427 overall winning percentage his first six years, including one with the Patriots.
Basically, the reason Del Rio has a bad record is because we play in the same division as the Colts, the winningest team since Del Rio became head coach. Think about that, if it was someone else instead of the Colts, we would very likely have won our division four years in a row. If there’s something you should be up in arms about, it’s Del Rio’s inability to consistently win against Houston.
by Kbot on Jun 20, 2009 8:07 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I don’t think two trips to the playoffs in six years is “pretty good.” Del Rio may have said it out loud that he wants to improve the team’s division record but that should have been known from day one. No coach comes in thinking it’s alright to have a mediocre or losing divisional record. Admittedly I shouldn’t have put that final words there but it was to punctuate my point. Six years and not a single divisional winning record. Forget that he mentioned it at a season ending presser, fact remains he’s got a losing record against each divisional opponent.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 1:10 AM EDT reply actions 0 recs
There You Go
Every coach needs to start his career with a team with the goal in mind to win divisional games first. You play the teams twice a year, they are your rivals, they are the way to get into the playoffs, and the fans love nothing more to stomp the Titans or Colts.
If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik
by Bestjagfan on Jun 20, 2009 10:39 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
the funny thing is,
if we win 9 games and go 3-3 in the division,
people will start to like him again, an improvement in ’10 and people will think we have a great coach that was hidden by bad drafts
funny what winning does
LateRoundPick.com
by Surteal on Jun 20, 2009 5:52 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs
That's exactly what I mean.
People overreact because of one bad season, and I just want them to realize that nothing’s really changed from a year ago. It’s amazing what one bad year does to people’s perceptions, just as a good year does.
by Kbot on Jun 20, 2009 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I can't speak for others.
But I’ve been questioning Del Rio since 2004 and that egg of a game against Houston. I’m all in favor of more seasons like 2007 but I look at his last thee and he’s been average, literally, 24-24. He gets this year obviously and with marked improvement should get 2010 but if we aren’t back in the playoffs he needs to go. If he goes eight seasons with two playoff appearances that is bad, I don’t care who’s in the division.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 20, 2009 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I know what you're saying,
but you have to keep in mind that he has only been a head coach for six years. That might seem like a long time to a fan, but in terms of coaching experience, that’s very little. I agree if he cannot improve by 2010, we will need a new coach, but until then, I’ll support Del Rio. This is even more important considering Tony Dungy is no longer coaching in the division. Remember, Indianapolis is the winningest team of the decade, with Peyton Manning having won more games than any QB in a decade, ever. I think the Colts’ recent success really does have to be taken into consideration. That’s asking Del Rio to beat the most successful coach and most successful quarterback (since Del Rio became head coach) with lesser talent, and a draft man who is no where near as talented as Bill Polian. Hopefully this year’s roster will prove to be enough to finally overcome the Colts.
by Kbot on Jun 21, 2009 4:04 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
You bring up interesting points
But his total dvision record ain’t just vs the Colts. He can’t beat the Texans or the Titans with any consistency either. And it isn;t just one bad season as was said ealier, it’s the entire body of work. I agree with you that we are in one of the toughest divisions, but the fact remains if we can’t beat divison rivals, we’re probably not going very far.
I do agree with you that if by 2010 we’ere not seeing significant improvement WITH consistnecy, he needs to go.
by OGN on Jun 21, 2009 8:08 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Without discussing the Colts too much.
I think they’ll be find. They’ve got Manning and that’s what’s important. When Belichick was in Cleveland he sucked. He goes to New England find this guy named Brady and he’s a winner. I think Indy will be just fine without Dungy.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 21, 2009 9:24 AM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
players not plays….haha
LateRoundPick.com
by Surteal on Jun 21, 2009 1:58 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
I smell a Vic disciple.
and I meant “I think they’ll be fine”. Jeez what an idiot.
Jacksonville Jaguars. It's what I do.
by JvilleJag2 on Jun 21, 2009 6:11 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
It's true.
Lack of quality players is a recipe for failure. Hopefully Gene Smith has a better eye for talent than Shack Harris, and so far it looks that way.
by Kbot on Jun 21, 2009 4:26 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
yeah and with peyton,
it doesn’t matter what plays they call….just think
week 5, we might be saying that about the “slimproved” Garrard
LateRoundPick.com
by Surteal on Jun 21, 2009 10:01 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Damn.
I was gonna steal that one
If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik
by Bestjagfan on Jun 21, 2009 11:28 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
good thing i got it them
i was really worried…..lol
LateRoundPick.com
by Surteal on Jun 22, 2009 5:00 PM EDT up reply actions 0 recs
Del Rio all the way!
Jack is the right man for the job, he came to a team that was, well lets say it, terrible, and had to rebuilt it. The failure of the team came with think-for-themselves players, who let the team down or injuries that players never fully came back from. Del Rio inspires the team and keeps them in line, well on the field and in the locker room, but he isnt a mircle man. I hope to see jack prowlin’ the side lines of Jacksonville for a long time to come.
by Messina on Jun 20, 2009 10:07 PM EDT reply actions 0 recs

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