who will the jags draft?
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 11, 2011 1:19 PM EDT
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Printthis is my first post and im writting it before my next class so if its sloppy my bad
but im curious to see how other jags fans feel about the draft coming up next year. i think its safe to say we are gonna secure a top 7 pick in the upcoming draft and IMO i see three realistic prospects that we will be taking a close look at. we need a number 1 receiver and their are two on the board. we need a DE and there is a dominant end on the board. these are my breakdowns of who i think we will be looking at and tell me what you think
Justin blackmon-WR Oklahoma St. 6-1 210
Pros-good speed, explosive, playmaking ability, decent route runner, stretches the field on a regular basis, adjusts to the ball in the air very well, seems to have the "it" factor from what ive seen, good character hard worker
cons-solid hands but will drop some passes from time to time and has he already maxed out his talent?
breakdown- my personal favorite player in all of football right now i see him as a faster stronger better in every aspect(except hands) ochocinco who for most of his career was a top 7 receiver and a great weapon. i think he would be a great addition to this team
Alshon Jeffery-WR South carolina 6-4 230
pros- GREAT size, not great speed but enough to get by defenders on a regular basis, good solid hands, great leaping ability, deceptively elusive with the ball in his hands, strong run blocker, has red zone threat written all over him on the next level, hasnt maxed out potential with crappy qb play so who know how good he could be with gabbert?
cons-decent speed but isnt very explosive coming off the ball and getting in and out of breaks, sloppy route runner, long strides/slow feet might lead to not being able to get seperation on more advanced routes
breakdown-would be a great addition to the jags has every physical tool you look for in a future great receiver. i haven't heard much about his work ethic so i wont comment on it but if he has the drive i think he could be a phenomenal player. think poor mans calvin johnson(because of the difference in speed)
Quinton Coples-DE North Carolina 6-6 285
****i have not watched alot of north carolina games or a ton of film on him so i am not an expert on his play by any means and if i am wrong or missed anything let me know. im only going off a couple games last year that i watched and what i saw
pros-consistantly doubled and holds point, gets pressure almost every time hes singled, looks to be a very good athlete, strong prototypical DE that can play either side, explosive
cons-no moves, decent motor but doesnt seem to be a player that gives 100 percent every play, doesnt seem to have great speed
breakdown-this is who i think the jags will pick. WR in the top five isnt much value even though its a need unless its jerry rice or calvin johnson. so i think this is the most logical pick.
i think luck, kirkpatrick and kalil are in the mix too but IMO these are the three guys they will be looking at
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I think if we get the chance, we should draft Jeffery
but I keep getting the feeling that if Coples is there Gene will take him. I dont necessarily care if we get Coples or Jeffery, because either one has their benefits, but I just see Gene taking a lineman. I want Jeffery more though. Then again, this draft is very deep at WR and very thin at top level DE, so we could potentially draft Coples and then get Broyles, Fuller, or Floyd with our second pick. We would have a sick D if Coples produced, thats for sure.
by Dwalk1217 on Oct 11, 2011 2:00 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
you are assuming Gene is the GM
Personally, D. Harvey has scared me into using first round picks on DEs. If we pick high enough, I could very well see a lineman of some sort being drafted and then ealry in the second a guy like Fuller or Sanu being taken.
I def. think Floyd is gone by round 2, so he is not an option IMO.
I wasnt sure where he was projecting at
Either way i want to see a WR in the 1st or 2nd and an O lineman and DE as our other two picks in the first 3 rounds.
I know a lot of people like Jeffery
But I just attribute that to the SEC bias*
Justin Blackmon is a stud and I feel his pros are better than Jeffery’s and his cons aren’t as bad.
If we draft Coples, I’d probably start an #OccuplyEverBank movement
There isnt much bias for south carolina
"HULU: An evil plot to destroy the world. Enjoy"
Real fans don’t need a reason.
"Real G's move in silence like lasagna.." lol
by TheTealDeal on Oct 11, 2011 4:32 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions
It was a little bit of a joke
That because he’s from an SEC school he’s better than Blackmon.
Also it was more a dig at ESPN because it seems they seem to believe that only good talent seems to come out of the SEC (Andrew Luck being the exception)
From what I've seen of Blackmon he makes "pro plays"
and by “pro plays” I mean he fights for the ball in coverage, makes big catches when it counts, etc.
Twitter: BLByline Youtube: BLByline
I'm willing to drink the Kool-ade, but I'm hungry for the truth.
i wanna see how he does when he faces ou
pressure situation all eyes will be on him to make plays. i wanna see how he performs there before i personally anoint him the best pick for the jags this upcoming draft
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 11, 2011 8:09 PM EDT up reply actions
I def think he is an incredible option, but I am in awe of the size of Jeffery
BTW, how’s Israel treating you?
Alshon is the better Pro Prospect as far as Im concered
Has 3 inches and 20 lbs on Blackmon and is far more physical. Gene will be the GM by the way no way he leaves.
SCALP'EM
Jesus is Lord!
he leaves vs. he is fired/not extended
i say the latter should and does happen
by Jagsrok9008 on Oct 11, 2011 10:05 PM EDT up reply actions
thank you very much
but please explain why Gene deserves to remain GM?!!
by Jagsrok9008 on Oct 11, 2011 10:55 PM EDT up reply actions
Come on
Who has built our D to.top 10 in the league?
SCALP'EM
Jesus is Lord!
by Thunder64 on Oct 12, 2011 9:04 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions
Actually...
when you look at it, those free agents all came to join this team behind the vision that Gene has set to build this team upon, starting with Kampman. He said it himself when he joined the team, that it was organizational structure starting with Mr. Weaver, to Gene down to Jack that influenced his decision. Poz came not just for the chance to be back in a 4-3 but because he had TnT in front of him managing he line of scrimmage. Which happen to be two of Gene’s draft picks. No point in going over everybody but the point is there. Most of the free agents we have acquired came because they believed in the direction the team is headed. That really says something considering our small market and all. I mean come on, Coleman and Lowery came from the New York Jets to come and play for the Jacksonville Jaguars.
We happen to have a very bright future for once
So sorry that Gene hasn’t hit on every single draft pick. Or that every draft pick isn’t a league star from day 1.
by ScottyD4Life on Oct 12, 2011 9:12 AM EDT up reply actions
i think the problem is
that non of his draft picks are stars. three years is long enough to find atleast one player that is a potential pro bowler but he hasnt
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
Are you serious?
You people have some unreasonable expectations. Since the ‘09 draft here are a list of players that have become ’stars’ based on their level of play with their draft slot highlighted:
2009 Draft
QB Matthew Stafford (and he is just coming along and has Megatron) – Overall pick 1
DT B.J. Raji (who might not be a star because that defense as a whole is good) – Overall pick 9
LB Brian Orakpo (this guy is a play maker, period) – Overall pick 13
QB Josh Freeman (still in making of becoming a star) – Overall pick 18
LB Clay Matthews – Overall pick 26
WR Hakeem Nicks (1100+ receiving yards and 11 TD’s last year is star material) – Overall pick 29
RB Arian Foster (league leader in rushing yards and TD’s last year) – Overall pick N/A [UDFA]
2010
DT Ndamukong Suh – Overall pick 2
S Eric Berry (cracked top 100 NFL players last year, must count for something) – Overall pick 5
C Maurkice Pouncey (made Pro Bowl as a rookie) – Overall pick 18
DE Carlos Dunlap (9 sacks in the last six games of last season) – Overall pick 54
Really no point in saying anything about this years draft yet although Cam Newton (1) and A.J. Green (4) have shown that they will be stars in the league.
So out of 508 draft picks between the ‘09 and ’10 draft, 11 players have solidified themselves as a NFL star, with a few of them being questionable selections. Of course there are other solid players but not many stars. Simply put, most of Gene’s selections have been solid, which is what this team is becoming. I think the problem is that you aren’t looking at the big picture.
Oh yeah, I’d say Terrance and Tyson both have Pro Bowl potential.
My pleasure.
What’s funny about my comment is that it was just the tip of the iceberg as far as a real analysis goes. I could have went on and on but figured this was enough to get the point across, which you have assured me of.
yeah you missed a feww
and my definition of star is an impact player that changes the way your team plays so maybe my definition is different than yours
but you missed
2008 draft:
WR percy harvin #22-probowler
TE brandon pettigrew #20-top 5 TE
S Malcolm Jenkins #14-top 7 safety
WR Kenny Britt #30-Was destroying the NFL before he got hurt
LB James Laurinitis #35-top 5 MLB
S Jarius Byrd #42-went to a pro bowl
RB Lesean Mccoy #53-top 7 RB
OT Sebastion Volmer #58-future pro bowl T
WR Mike Wallace #84-top 7 receiver
2009 Draft
CB Joe Haden #7-playing at a pro bowl level
DE Jason pierre paul #15-one of the leaders in sacks this year
CB Devin Mccourty- pro bowler
TE Rob Gronkowslki-top 7 TE
TE Jimmy graham-top 5 in receiving yards this year
so yeah you missed some GREAT players. and youre high if you think tyson is playing at a pro bowl level this year.
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 11:52 AM EDT up reply actions
correction 2009 and 2010 draft*
sorry wrote that during class and wasnt really paying attention
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 12:06 PM EDT up reply actions
Yeah...
our definition of star is very different. The only players that you can make a case for is Kenny Britt and Jason Pierre Paul because he already has seven sacks this year. Other than that, every other you mentioned are not stars. I just went and looked at their stats and none of them says ‘star’ to me. I could sit here and go into detail about each one of them, but it’d take more time that I’d care to spend at the moment. So no, I didn’t miss great players, I left out some decent to good ones; not any ‘stars’.
And I never said Tyson was playing at a Pro Bowl level this year, I said he has Pro Bowl potential, which he does. We all know he is playing injured which is keeping him from playing as good as many of us knows he can.
how in the heck
does rob gronkowski having 10 touchdowns last year(TE leader)
devin mcourty having 7 ints(second only to ed reed)
lesean mccoy being top 5 rushing this year
and both mike wallace and jimmy graham be top 5 in receiving yards this year(ahead of clavin johnson)
not say star potential?
and stats arent everything that show a GREAT player which some of those guys will be considered in the next 3 years.
and regarding tyson i dont see how he is a future pro bowler. hes a solid player but to get into to pro bowl you have to be top 4 or 5 at your position in the conference. and hes not especially considering what he was brought in to do(get sacks) he isnt doing
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 12:39 PM EDT up reply actions
OK...
Rob Gronkowski had 10 TD’s last year because he had Tom Brady throwing him the ball. No way he does on any other team.
Devin McCourty having 7 ints is impressive but I doubt he has another performance like that. Reggie Nelson also had a good rookie outing before being exposed for who he really is, so let’s give this one some time to play out.
Forget this year, since we’re only 5 games in (except with Pierre-Paul, seven sacks is beastly). Since Lesean has been drafted he has been average either way you cut it.
Mike Wallace is no star right now regardless of what his stats say thus far this season and Jimmy Graham has Drew Brees throwing him the ball in a pass oriented offense, so he should have stats to reflect that.
And I’d argue that if he can get this knee issue behind him, Tyson will be one of the best DT’s in the AFC in a year or two.
ok so you just
knitpicked at some guys because they have good qbs throwing them the ball or that it wont happen again because you think it wont? those arent valid arguments im sorry
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 1:27 PM EDT up reply actions
This debate is...
going nowhere fast now. Because if you don’t believe that who is the QB is not going to have an affect on the stats of a WR or TE, then I don’t know what else to say. I’m not sure how you could try to argue with me on that.
And what do you mean by “that it won’t happen again because you think it won’t?”. If you’re talking about what I said about McCourty and giving it more time before you consider him a star, then I don’t get what you are saying there either. One year of good performance doesn’t make you a star in this league, it takes consistency and he hasn’t shown he will be consistent. So until he does, he not a star in my mind. Which is why I said some of the guys I mentioned aren’t even there yet because they haven’t done it year in and year out yet.
We could have this discussion all day but truth of the matter is that we haven’t had long enough so say whether or not Gene is right answer at GM for this team or not. And to not renew his contract after this year would be a premature decision in my eyes.
seriously?
qb play does have an affect but they have never had TE as productive as graham and gronkowski so i think it has to do more with their play rather than the qb. they are good quarterbacks by getting their playmakers the ball
i was talking about mccourtey and your right when it takes more then one year to be a star but when the person only has one year of perfomance thats what you have to go on?
they havent done it year in year out because theyve only been in the league 2 YEARS at most. come on now
and i think 3 years is by far enough time to judge a performance by a gm. Give ME 5 years and ill luck into a couple good picks. 3 years is enough. right now we arent that talented outside of our free agent signings and mjd and thats because genes draft picks havent been anything other than average.
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 2:23 PM EDT up reply actions
No,...
they are great quarterbacks because they can make all of the throws and make the right decisions. It is well documented about the success Tom Brady has had without too many playmakers at the WR position even before Randy Moss came. And I don’t even know how many 4,000 plus yard seasons Brees had before they drafted Graham, which makes it evident that it had more to do with him and the system he plays in than who he was throwing it too. Even though Brees has had a good group of receivers to throw the ball to over the years.
And you really must’ve not been paying attention if you think luck has anything to do with what Gene has been doing. Even if you don’t like him, his work ethic is something that could never be questioned. Everything he’s done has been a calculated move in attempt to make the team better through his eyes. I can’t say that I’ve agreed with everything that has taken place, but it’s easier for me to accept because I know that the decisions he has made are informed ones.
but lets put the star argument aside
maybe i used the wrong word but why dont we have any players on our team like that? other than lesean mccoy and the TE if any one of those players were on our team they would be by far the best player at their position. thats why gene needs to go. he hasnt even drafted any really good players let alone stars. other than mike thomas and knighton they are all easily replaceable
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 12:45 PM EDT up reply actions
When you look at it...
the only player he ‘missed’ on was Sebastion Vollmer, but that doesn’t even count because he was selected 18 picks after Gene selected Britton in the second round of the ‘09 draft. He didn’t have a chance to pick any of those other players because they were selected before he had another pick, so as Vic used to say, you can’t get them all.
And really? Easily replaceable? I don’t think so. Maybe upgraded but easily replaceable is far from being accurate. Once again, I think you are missing the big picture. Most of the players he has drafted has filled in holes that were glaring weaknesses before. Gene didn’t inherit a situation where he could spend early round picks on positions like WR, S, LB, and TE. He set out to rebuild the lines on both sides of the ball, which he has done and then go from there. He was fortunate enough to already have an All-Pro running back and tight end on the team, so it didn’t have to be a high priority to address in the draft.
The way I see it is he got us our QB of the future, retooled the offensive line (although it’s still a work in progress) and built a respectable defense in three years on the job. He hasn’t been perfect, but he has been doing his job and this team will be better for it.
ok
again. we could have gotten percy, kenny britt, pierre paul but im not gonna blame him for those cuz who woulda guessed they would be that good?
but i will blame him for passing on pouncey for alualu
my problem with him is he drafts solely small school players that havent panned out at all (other than knighton) and trades away picks like theyre nothing. and he refuses to adress our two biggest needs since jdr took helm. DE and WR. a good gm would have already adressed them instead of being sitting on his hands and waiting for untalented players to prove they are just that, untalented.
he either changes the way he does things or we get someone else because if he keeps doing things HIS way we will be in trouble his picks are already starting to bust(britton, the enitre 2010 draft} and we dont need another set back
and oh we havent improved our record at all since hes been GM we have actually gotten worse
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 12, 2011 2:35 PM EDT up reply actions
If Gene would've drafted Pouncey...
who would’ve been our other starting DT right now? Honestly, I’d rather have Tyson.
And you’re talking about me knitpicking but you’re being critical of Gene missing on a second round pick, even though Britton could still be an important piece of us eventually having one of the better o-lines in the league. Then you say the entire 2010 draft is starting to bust, so lets take a closer look.
1 10 Tyson Alualu Defensive tackle 6’3 295 lb California
3 74 D’Anthony Smith Defensive tackle 6’2 300 lb Louisiana Tech
5 143 Larry Hart Outside linebacker 6’1 248 lb Central Arkansas
5 153 Austen Lane Defensive end 6’6 267 lb Murray State
6 180 Deji Karim Running back 5’112 205 lb Southern Illinois
6 203 Scotty McGee Kick returner 5’9 190 lb James Madison
If Gene would’ve had a second round pick, the pick would’ve been LB Sean Lee from Penn State, who would’ve probably just been considered another average pick by most fans. So out this draft class the only players that aren’t on the roster are Larry Hart and Scotty McGee, which are 5th and 6th round selections. D’Anthony suffered a major injury and had he not, we probably would’ve had one of the best young DT rotations in the league right now. We both know where Tyson, Austin and Deji fit on the team, so no need in discussing them. So I still don’t see how you think the entire class is starting to bust. Also, you might as well add Kirk Morrison into the equation because we acquired him there too. He wasn’t the best while here, but he was serviceable. If you go back and look at the entire draft, that draft class isn’t as bad as you are making it out to be.
And lastly, you’re wrong about the record thing. We went 5-11 in 2008, the year before he was hired. To 7-9 his first year in 2009, to 8-8 his second year last season. Many of us will agree that they overachieved both of those season, which could be pointed to a number of factors. This is the first year the record has tooken a hit since his tenure and if not for a few errors here and there, that wouldn’t even be the case. Once again, I think this all comes back to the fact that I don’t think you are looking at the bigger picture in regards to your opinion of the job Gene has been doing.
fair assesment
We could still have john henderson…..
who is currently playing at a higher level than alualu in oakland
thats your opinion but i think its evident karim will be gone by the next two years because he offers nothing. so basically out of the 2010 draft class you have an average DT(the way hes played so far has proven that) with the potential to be a good DT and a nothing but average DE that can only stop the run and has limited stats. How is that not a BAD draft?
and there comes a point when the wait and see approach doesnt work anymore. we have waited we have seen. and for three years gene has made this team better in comparison to shaq harris. but lets be honest would you consider us on the same level team wise as the steeler and packers? no thats what we should be aiming for and we arent even close after 3 years. WE SHOULDNT SETTLE FOR AVERAGE. everybody is ok with 8-8 for this team and i think thats bullsh*** good respected teams in the nfl dont have to take 5 or 6 years off from relevancy to REBUILD for most of my adult life. we should strive to be the best team in the nfl and we arent even close due to the coach and the players on the field. THAT NEEDS TO CHANGE
i understand that process takes a while and i gave gene time 3 years as a matter of fact and we are nowhere near the top of the league and we are in the same exact spot as before he was here so he as got to go
We should be striving to win a superbowl just not be 8-8 and gene wont get us there so he should go. hes shown with his draft picks thatt he misses more often than he hits and when he hits theyre average
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 14, 2011 10:29 AM EDT up reply actions
I'm going to keep this short.
Go back and look at that entire draft and do a re-mock of who you would’ve drafted. Henderson over Alualu? Yeah, you really don’t see the big picture at all. And then you use the Steelers, who has had their GM since 2000 and the Packers, theirs since 2005 as comparisons. Those were bad examples to use. Other than that you basically repeated yourself all over again. This conversation is offically dead.
youre wrong
packers records
2005-4-12
2006-8-8
2007-13-3
^shows you what a good gm can do to a team
gene isnt a good gm hes average and thats the bottom line he will never be a gm of a superbowl team. NEVER
Cold Blooded
by Jaggaholic82 on Oct 14, 2011 8:32 PM EDT up reply actions
Alshon Jeffery has potential written all over him...
Blackmon, like his predecessor Dez looks really explosive and like a solid playmaker. BUT i really like Jeffrey to become an unstoppable force. 6’4" = size b/w andre and calvin. Good hands. Bad QB. 230 lb receiver with good speed.
idk, i just have a gut feeling jeffery will become great. just like i have that feeling about adrian clayborn from this years draft…haha
Considering...
the fact that I don’t follow college football, so I’m not familiar with the players as far as their potential as prospect goes, I can only target certain position. I’d say in the first three rounds of the draft these positions are targeted: OL, CB and WR in no particular order. Although at the same time I could see DE and LB being addressed early in the draft also. I’m just hoping that next year we could trade back in the first round for a change instead of trading up and giving up picks. That’s only if situation calls for it though.
Im with Keenan here
Overall Gene has developed good young players who have a great CHANCE at being Pro Bowlers with better coaching.
Players like: Pot Roast, AluAlu(when not injured), Gabbert, MonrowCox all can be Pro Bowlers with full health and BETTER COACHING.
SCALP'EM
Jesus is Lord!
Thanks.
Although I think Alfie would disagree with you on your opinion of Cox having Pro Bowl potential.
But in all seriousness, it’s interesting you bring up the coaching in this because that is the one intangible in this discussion that I don’t have an opinion on. I’ve never been in a situation to have been coached per se, so I don’t fully understand the impact it has on the development of the players. I’m one that’s neutral on the future of the coaching staff, primarily in regards to Del Rio. But if there are coaches out there that could help the players we have develop better, I’d be all for it.
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