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What does Derrick Harvey's future hold?

While Harvey certainly hasn't developed into the best player on the Jaguars defense like I once thought he would, he's been a little better than people give him credit for. Although he has only tallied a disappointing eight sacks through his three seasons in Jacksonville, he has been a strong contributor as a run defender.

However, even after three poor years of pass rushing, the Jaguars brass have yet to throw Harvey under the bus for his lack of production. Gene Smith told Josh Oesher of Jaguars.com that he still holds hope for the 24 year old:

"He's still young," Smith said. "He was a high draft choice and he has had a lot of starts for us. He's still young. You hope at some point he's going to be able to make a move. He did not make that last year during the season. We had some guys earn the opportunity to play over him."

Star-divide

Even with comments like that, though, it's hard to believe the Jaguars can continue to be patient with a player that has one of the biggest contracts on the team and is due just under $3 million in 2011. Is that salary worth paying to a player that seems like a longshot to start along the defensive line next season? Most logic would tell you that it isn't.

There are few different approaches the Jaguars could take in regards to Harvey:

a) Keep him on the roster, pay him his $3 million and hope that he finally is "able to make a move."
b) Ask him to take a pay cut so that he makes an amount more appropriate for a rotational player.
c) Release him and officially cleanse the team of the 2008 draft that spun the Jaguars into a rebuilding.
d) Trade him and recoup a bit of value.

As much as I'd love to hold on hope to the idea that Derrick Harvey could turn into the pass rushing nightmare for opposing quarterbacks, the reality that he could just be a giant bust is difficult to ignore. If the Jaguars are able to find a trade partner, that could be a very appealing option for them.

While it would initially seem crazy to think that a team would want to trade for a player that has essentially done nothing besides stop the run in his three seasons in the NFL, it might not be. After all, the Bengals traded to acquire Reggie Nelson based on athletic ability with the hope that he could develop into a quality safety in Cincinnati.

Now this is purely hypothetical, but one potential trade that could make sense is with the Denver Broncos. The Broncos had some strong depth at safety in 2010 with Brian Dawkins, Renaldo Hill, Darcel McBath and David Bruton, but added to it by drafting Rahim Moore and Quinton Carter in the 2nd and 4th rounds of the 2011 draft.

With their transition to a 4-3 in 2011, they could be in the hunt for a defensive end with run stopping ability and prototypical 4-3 size. While rare, a player for player trade could make sense for the two teams. Mile High Report's Sayre Bedinger even acknowledged the fact that Bruton could be the subject of a trade prior to the 2011 season, although he was hopeful that such a trade wouldn't happen.

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I still think he’ll be on the roster in 2011… For some reason.

by Alfie Crow on Jul 2, 2011 5:07 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Same here… I hope he makes strides this year that will make him a no-brainer to keep or resign (or whateverrrrr) him for 2012… I kinda doubt he has much of an impact at all, but here’s to hoping so!

Sean

Pax Armis Acquiritur

by cuffs007 on Jul 2, 2011 5:17 PM EDT up reply actions  

I dont care if he is one the roster at this point. I know what he is worth (nothing) so whatever happens with him I just simply do not care. He has done NOTHING so far and that is a shame because a lot of people had high hopes for him.

by Demetrius82 on Jul 2, 2011 5:18 PM EDT reply actions  

This picture really makes me feel sorry for Harvey.

That’s the look of a whipped man with absolutely no answers.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 2, 2011 7:47 PM EDT reply actions  

This is exactly what I think of when I picture him

Benched, confused…in a word, useless.

Granted, this picture seems to be used every time there is a Derrick Harvey article, but it’s quite appropriate

by Distance on Jul 3, 2011 12:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think Harvey is worthless.

I agree he is not playing like a #8 should play, but I think he plays very well against the run.He’s not a bad player to mix into the rotation.

Fidelis Ad Mortem

by JPQ! on Jul 2, 2011 8:58 PM EDT reply actions  

thing is, when you've got $3M down on the depth chart and 3 guys ahead of him not making as much

Hart, Lane, Mincey; then this is when egos start to come out. I think the keep him as a camp body to try to generate some trade interest.

Great article.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 2, 2011 9:35 PM EDT up reply actions  

The Jags don't have egos.

Twitter: BLByline Youtube: BLByline
I'm willing to drink the Kool-ade, but I'm hungry for the truth.

by Brian Levenson on Jul 3, 2011 12:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

the 1996 team didn't either...

then 1997 came around. Don’t ever think for a minute that money and contracts are not talked about in the locker room. Think about it. You’re Austen Lane and you’re a starting DE making $405K getting the crap beat out of him by RTs and you come off the field every so often and see a Derrick Harvey in a clean uniform, who just can’t figure out the pro game, and is taking up oxygen on the bench making $3M. Tell me that won’t give you a serious case of chapped ass! We do it in our everyday jobs whether it’s the lifetime achievement award winning supervisor or the girl with the nice rack but brainless who has shot her way up the ladder by hook or crook, so don’t think NFL players who know everyone else’s business and contract numbers don’t react the same way.

It’s one of the things that helped doom the 2008 team.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 3, 2011 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

+1

If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik

by Bestjagfan on Jul 3, 2011 5:59 PM EDT up reply actions  

If I was Austen Lane,

I’d know that once Harvey’s contract is up, he’s out on the streets and once my contract is up, I’m getting paid like an NFL starter.

Twitter: BLByline Youtube: BLByline
I'm willing to drink the Kool-ade, but I'm hungry for the truth.

by Brian Levenson on Jul 3, 2011 8:18 PM EDT up reply actions  

Here's his contract

7/14/2010: Signed a four-year, $1.974 million contract. The deal included a $184,190 signing bonus.
2011: $405,000, 2012: $490,000, 2013: $575,000, 2014: Free Agent (rotoworld)

You’re telling me, you’d expect that Lane (all things equal and Lane continues to improve steadily and become an excellent DE) will play the good and obedient soldier role being a heck of a bargain? These guys know they’re disposable.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 4, 2011 9:55 PM EDT up reply actions  

But they know he's on his rookie contract

Egos become a problem when you bring in outsiders for big money like in 2008. Often overlooked in the fast slide from 2007 was how divided the locker room became with guys like Mike Peterson openly complaining…

Here's hoping we have NFL football in 2011

by pksiv on Jul 5, 2011 8:37 AM EDT up reply actions  

I like your thinking and it did show itself in 2008

But, recall MJD making waves when he became the feature back? Bottom line, a player (no doubt pushed by his agent and hangers on) who is a 5th rounder who worked his way into a starting role will want that payday sooner than later. It’s not out of the realm of possibility for Weaver to tear up a deal and increase it.

I’m really hoping Lane has a monster year. The league needs to know about this kid.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 5, 2011 9:38 AM EDT up reply actions  

There's a HUGE difference

between MJD a couple years ago and what any of those other DE’s have done so far.

Here's hoping we have NFL football in 2011

by pksiv on Jul 5, 2011 9:55 AM EDT up reply actions  

They nearly doubled their sack total last year as a unit

and they were still awful. That doesn’t get anyone an MJD type contract.

Here's hoping we have NFL football in 2011

by pksiv on Jul 5, 2011 11:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

obviously so..

You’re getting in the weeds. Point is, any 5th rounder who starts and plays head and shoulders above a first rounder will justifiably demand and should command a hefty pay raise. Running back money, no.

Now to be sure to make sure we don’t dissect each word:

YES I am aware Lane is entering his second year and there is not enough of a body of work to determine whether he is the man or that he can take that next step

YES I am aware he was for all intents and purposes a starter by default. I imagine the ideal plan once Kampman went down was for he and Hart to split time opposite Harvey and as it turned out Mincey.

YES I am aware there are not a lot of James Harrisons out there

YES I am aware that our D line has been piss poor since 2008 and we’ve rebuilt it.

YES I am aware that he should not expect an MJD type contract. BUT, I would contend that if he keeps improving over the next couple of years he’s going to get a commensurate raise. Think 5th rounder contract to next raise vice 2nd round contract to next raise.

Jason Taylor has not been tied to his draft position contract during his career. “Yeah, we’d love to pay you, but even though you’ve proven to be one of the dominant D linemen of the past 13 years, the fact is you’re still a 3rd rounder and you still played at Akron. So we don’t think we’ll pay you what you’re worth.”

by Joe Fisher on Jul 5, 2011 2:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Totally disagree
Point is, any 5th rounder who starts and plays head and shoulders above a first rounder will justifiably demand and should command a hefty pay raise.

He doesn’t get a raise because he takes a job from someone who is almost unanimously considered a bust. There is not a single DE on the Jaguars that has earned a raise yet. Sure, Harvey is overpaid. But that doesn’t automatically make the guy/guys who start in front of him overpaid.

Here's hoping we have NFL football in 2011

by pksiv on Jul 5, 2011 2:24 PM EDT up reply actions  

hopefully all of them.

You want a starter with every pick, that’s why you draft.

Twitter: BLByline Youtube: BLByline
I'm willing to drink the Kool-ade, but I'm hungry for the truth.

by Brian Levenson on Jul 5, 2011 7:07 PM EDT up reply actions  

Hopefully is the operative word

You draft at that point for those proverbial jars on the shelf. If you draft a guy in the 5th round with the hope that he’ll start next year, you are currently in trouble at that spot. NFL in its current form is not built for Moneyball.

Football is a game of replacement, you know.

Think I heard that from someone.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 5, 2011 8:31 PM EDT up reply actions  

And they either earn their rookie contract

or they get replaced. Even Potroast needs to play out his rookie contract. That’s the way the league works.

And as I’ve said, none of the DE’s have played anywhere near the level they’d need to be at to get new contracts. Chris Johnson had a reasonable argument when he rushed for 2,000 yards. Just being the best of a crappy group of DE’s is not the same thing.

Here's hoping we have NFL football in 2011

by pksiv on Jul 6, 2011 2:30 PM EDT up reply actions  

I don't think he actually plays that well against the run

I think it’s just better than he plays the pass. I distinctly remember him getting benched in the KC game because he filled the wrong gap, allowing Thomas Jones a 70 yard run.

He doesn’t do anything well enough to deserve 3 mil.

by Distance on Jul 3, 2011 12:32 PM EDT up reply actions  

Because he messed up

once badly, doesn’t mean he doesn’t usually play well.

by Ewdtrey on Jul 3, 2011 2:03 PM EDT up reply actions  

True

I just can’t think of any examples of him doing anything well, playing either the run or the pass. The one standout Harvey play, in my mind, is his whiff in that KC game.

by Distance on Jul 4, 2011 9:29 AM EDT up reply actions  

huh?

If he played well, he would have been in the starting line up.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 4, 2011 9:47 PM EDT up reply actions  

ok...

So what exactly was he effective at? Tackling? No. Taking up space so the interior could bull rush? No. Sacking? Definitely not. Rushing the passer? You said it yourself.

Getting as much mileage out of his performance in the BCS Championship and parlay it into a top 10 pick as he could? This you could make a case for. Also, you could probably make a case that he did not have anyone on the other side who was able to pick up the slack, but a top 10 pick should not be allowed excuses.

Our best hope is that the game slows down for him and he has a Mario Williams type season. But he’s got to get it done when the games matter.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 5, 2011 7:58 AM EDT up reply actions  

He's a good tackler

He’s also good at stacking and shedding. He’s good at taking on double teams. He’s actually pretty good at getting pressure. He’s also good at dropping into coverage for a 6’5" 43DE.

by Ewdtrey on Jul 7, 2011 12:06 AM EDT up reply actions  

Although I don't think he'll be here when it's all said and done

Maybe one more year under Cullen will finally pay off. It’s just a thought

by Dwalk1217 on Jul 2, 2011 11:26 PM EDT via mobile reply actions  

Harvey will be on the roster next year.

A team doesn’t usually cut a player unless he’s worthless and Harvey isn’t. He’s a solid run-stuffer, and really all he needs to add is a little closing speed and he’ll be a decent pass rusher.
A team can’t trade a player unless someone wants him and let’s face it, teams likely won’t want him that much. A rotational player with 3 mill due to him is not great trade bait.

You don’t wanna cut him and you don’t wanna trade him. Odds are, he’ll be back.

Twitter: BLByline Youtube: BLByline
I'm willing to drink the Kool-ade, but I'm hungry for the truth.

by Brian Levenson on Jul 3, 2011 12:42 AM EDT reply actions  

As I’ve said before… Hate to cut a 24 year old top 10 pick DE at year 4.

by Alfie Crow on Jul 3, 2011 9:45 AM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

in accounting terms

wouldn’t he be labeled a “sunk cost” right about now?

by Joe Fisher on Jul 3, 2011 10:04 AM EDT up reply actions  

Yes, but you still have to consider how bad it looks giving up after 3 seasons if the light comes on in 2011 on another team. Teams “make sure” before looking bad.

by Alfie Crow on Jul 3, 2011 4:35 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

good point

perhaps they were hoping that trading Reggie Nelson for a bag of Fritos would have turned the light on for Harvey.

by Joe Fisher on Jul 4, 2011 9:58 PM EDT up reply actions  

That is a glimmer of hope, but

I think that has more to do with the fact that we were misusing Groves. He was supposed to be an OLB and we tried to make him a DE.

by Conservative on Jul 4, 2011 10:03 AM EDT up reply actions  

Groves

just doesn’t have it in any scheme.

by Ewdtrey on Jul 5, 2011 2:42 AM EDT up reply actions  

If I am GM Gene

I give him til the end of preseason (assuming we have one) to learn a move other than the bull rush. And when he is in position to sack a QB, how to actually finish off a sack. If he can’t then then I look to cut / trade him.

by duuuvaaalll on Jul 3, 2011 1:48 PM EDT reply actions  

he played in 15 games and made 12 tackles

I don’t know how many plays he was in on, but those are jerry porter-type numbers.

Section 442, RIP
"You think you know, but you don't know."

by unhipcat on Jul 3, 2011 3:24 PM EDT reply actions  

I never understood the obsession with Harvey’s “tackles” game to game. I’ve never been concerned with how many tackles a DLineman has.

by Alfie Crow on Jul 3, 2011 4:36 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions   1 recs

+1

If hip hop is dead, then it happened the day that Dilla died.
-Akrobatik

by Bestjagfan on Jul 3, 2011 6:00 PM EDT up reply actions  

Where's the obsession?

He’s a #8 pick selected as a pass-rush end who has eight sacks in three years who’s now being described as “run-stuffing end” who had a grand total of 12 tackles in an entire season. He’s not a space-eating DT or nose tackle taking on blockers so linebackers can make the tackles. In this case, the numbers, or the lack thereof, are telling and probably have something to do with him riding the bench while fourth-round picks and free agents are getting the playing time.

Section 442, RIP
"You think you know, but you don't know."

by unhipcat on Jul 4, 2011 1:23 PM EDT via mobile up reply actions  

He’s gone… Last year was set up for Derrick to finally take that step. Not only did he fail to do that, he regressed.

With Aaron Kampman back, Jeremy Mincey improving, and the 3 rookies from a year ago. There won’t be room for Derrick Harvey.

I expect him to be cut prior to week 1, or maybe traded for a conditional 7th round pick or another low level player from another team — like the example of David Bruton from Denver.

by Kevin Hine on Jul 3, 2011 5:50 PM EDT reply actions  

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