Which RECEIVERS do we keep? Stats to follow
by Mullayo on Jan 30, 2012 3:54 AM EST
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PrintI based my post on an article the intrepid Rhett found and fanshotted about who got the dropsies in our receiving corp. http://www.bigcatcountry.com/2012/1/29/2756991/how-many-passes-did-each-receiver-drop#comments
I thought drops without knowing the times the reciever was targetted are pretty useless so I looked it up.
Many people are mocking us multiple WRs in the draft and free agency but how about a tight end?
Lewis was the biggest culprit and drop off from last year with 10 drops by himself. A pass catching tight end could be more of a need than a WR? Give us two tightend sets and competition for the complacent Marcedes.
We have to keep some of these muppets but which ones?
'Maybe Mike Thomas didn't have such a bad year if you compare the stats that follow? How important is his $18m contract?
Maybe, based on the stats, Chastin West could have been targeted more? And kept?
How about Robiskie and Price? Better the devil you know with Hill and Dillard or should we punt on the great unkown of the first two?
How important is Osgood on specail teams? Is he untouchable?
Does the rookie Shorts deserve another year? He's the same age as 4 other recievers?
THESE ARE THE DAYS OF OUR LIVES...
I assume in the next offseason we get 3 newbies so we need three or four of the current WRs... and a catching tight end?
Maurice Jones-Drew: 43 receptions 3 drops = 6.7% drops
8.7yds/rec, 3TD,(Exp, 7, 26 yrs, 5ft7in, 210lb) big contract
Chastin West 13 receptions 1 drop = 7.5% drops
12.5 yds/rec,1 TD (Exp2, 24yrs, 6ft1in, 214lb)
Mike Thomas: 44 receptions 5 drops = 10% drops
9.4 yds/rec, 1 TD (Exp 3, 24yrs, 5ft9in, 198lb) big contract
Deji Karim: 14 recs, 2 drops = 12% drops
8.6yds/rec (Exp 3, 25yrs, 5ft8in, 209lb) rookie contract
Jarred Dillard: 29 receptions 5 drops = 14% drops
10.1yds/rec, 1 TD (Exp 3, 26yrs, 5ft10, 187lb) rookie contract
Jason Hill: 25 receptions, 5 drops = 17.5% drops
14.5yds/rec, 3TD (24yrs
Marcedes Lewis: 39 receptions 10 drops = 20% drops
11.8yds/rec, 0TD (27yrs,6ft6in, 275lb) big contract
Kasim Osgood: 5 receptions, 2 drops = 28% drops
8.4yds/rec, 0TDs (Exp9, 31yrs,6ft5in, 220lb)
Cecil Shorts: 2 receptions 2 drops = he drops HALF his passes
15yds/rec, 1 TD (Exp 1, 24yrs, 6ft, 193lb) rookie contract
Brian Robiskie: -------------(Exp 3, 24yrs, 6ft3in, 209lb)
Taylor Price:------------------(Exp 3, 24yrs, 6ft, 205lb)
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Neither combo
For one, you have Hill on the list and he was cut mid season
Hill is already gone...not sure why he is on here
by StylezMcKoolaid on Jan 30, 2012 8:32 AM EST reply actions
My bad. No wonder I couldn't find him on the official roster.
I totally forgot we cut him, that said he had the best finish to the season of all our WRs!
What could of happened; did.
I'd rather keep the 3 guys we drafted...Dillard, Thomas and Shorts
by StylezMcKoolaid on Jan 30, 2012 8:33 AM EST reply actions 1 recs
I think I agree with you here
Question is, will the team keep 5,6 or 7 WRs? I have a feeling we’re going to get 2 to 3 in some combination through FA and/or draft. I can see a 3 way battle between Price, Robiskie and Osgood.
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I agree with that
but Osgood is far superior in special teams than the other 2. It’s a matter of whether the Jaguars feel they still need 2 special teams aces with high numbers.
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Osgood does not really compete for a WR-spot
Osgood competes with back-up LBs, Safeties for a roster spot. The positive thing about Osgood being a WR is that you can have more WR active on gameday than other teams, who fill the gameday roster with mostly defensive backups.
I consider having Osgood as an asset few teams have. He is a gamechanger (especially if we are going to have a decent punter again) on a team that does not have many players of his category (Owens, MJD, Poz, D. Smith, Mathis, AK74, maybe our DTs, Jones) that not bringing him back would be a really dumb and shortsighted decision. Just remember how the chargers special teams (with osgood a streangth) sucked when he left them.
Wonderful point...
in regards to Osgood. He’s a ST guy that just happens to play WR and replacing him wouldn’t be easy to do. So we might as well take him out of the equation when it comes to the number game when discussing the receiver position.
And I agree that Lewis needs competition at TE.
by Catfanatic1979v1 on Jan 30, 2012 8:44 AM EST reply actions
Competition...
or not, he’s not going anywhere so adding another pass catching tight end is only challenging Zach Miller to stay healthy. No tight end is going to come here and supplant Marcedes from his #1 spot on the depth chart.
Agreed...partly
if Marcedes starts out the same way he looked this past year; a decent TE could easily take his place.
I just got re-pissed at how terrible Marcedes was this past year.
You can't place...
all of the blame at the feet of Marcedes for his struggles last season. Drops were prevalent across the board as illustrated by this post and I think some of it had to do with the way Blaine throws the ball. You don’t see many QB’s, even some of the better ones in the league, throw the ball with such velocity the way Gabbert does. After an entire offseason of getting used to it, I think we’ll see drops become less and less of an issue for all involved in the passing game. The guy throws a hell of a fastball and you’d have to think that it can’t be that easy catching it.
But to what you said about a ‘decent’ TE “easily” taking his place. That couldn’t be more inaccurate. There’s no way someone of a decent talent level could easily come in and take the place of someone with the talent level of a player such as Marcedes. He’d have to struggle mightily for an entire season for something like to happen.
by kjones407 on Jan 30, 2012 12:33 PM EST up reply actions 1 recs
Much of the balme is on Blaine
no doubt. But, we basically agree.
You said:
He’d have to struggle mightily for an entire season for something like to happen.
I said:
if Marcedes starts out the same way he looked this past year
= struggled mightily
I think Marcedes will be fine this year. I know he is a valuable.
You also have to realize
that catching Passes isn’t Marcedes only job. And I don’t think he has much competition at the level he performs his other duties.
I agree thats not his only job
but they are paying him like they are for him to be a blocking TE, they were paying for a playmaker as well
by Sylvester.The.Jaguar.fan on Jan 31, 2012 6:35 PM EST up reply actions
I agree that Marcedes stays and this was just a blip...
But I guarantee you that he had more than 10 drops. Plus, it would have been nice for him to make a tough catch every now and then. Young QBs need that help from veteran guys.
That said, I watched every play this year at least once, and there is NO WAY you can lay drops at the feet of the QB in the case of Lewis. Gabbert couldn’t have handed the ball to him any better on the three TDs he dropped. If you are a receiver and the ball touches your hands, you have to make the catch. It might be a tough catch, but that is why they are pros.
I look for Marcedes to bounce back in a big way next season. He works hard and he will make it happen.
by Jag-er-meister on Jan 31, 2012 5:47 PM EST up reply actions
perhaps, but there were some damning throws that were right there that were missed
most notably the one vs Houston where he was all alone in the end zone. That throw seemed to rattle Gabbert.
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No doubt.
Some of the drops sometimes by whoever was catching it were unacceptable. As you’re pointing to, I think those unacceptable drops by the pass catchers had a negative effect on Blaine’s confidence in them. The one that comes mind for me is the drop by Osgood. I don’t remember who we were playing but all he had to do was catch it and walk into the endzone but he dropped it and the safety hit him and a flag was called for a hit on a defenseless receiver. If I remember correctly, we still scored but I don’t think Blaine liked the fact he had another incompletion added and a touchdown taken away from his stats.
Obviously a bad play, but in his defense the ball was tipped.
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by Brian Levenson on Jan 30, 2012 4:25 PM EST up reply actions
You're wrong Brian
http://www.nfl.com/videos/nfl-game-highlights/09000d5d82482d20/Texans-vs-Jaguars-highlights
Watch about the 1:10 mark
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that's the play I'm talking about
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Thomas and Shorts for sure
Shorts needs some time. Remember 1 of his 2 receptions was a really nice TD grab.
West and Dillard will fill out the other spots. Price and Robiskie obviously get a chance to de-throne these two.
Let training camp...
and the preseason sort them out. I don’t think we’ll add any more than two receivers because how I see it, we only need two. A true #1 that warrants coverage being rolled his way and a number #2 that can take advantage of man to man situations. Also, we’ll still be primarily a run first team, so adding more than two receivers that can do these two things really aren’t neccassary. It’s not like we’ll be seeing a lot of 4 or 5 receiver sets except for on guranteed passing downs, such as third and longs. MJD will still be the best player on our offense, so I think the new offensive scheme will be built around him until Blaine proves that he can be the focus of the offense.
And 5 drops by Thomas? From the way people were talking, you’d think the guy had much more than that.
The issue for Thomas..
was that he seemed to give up on routes. There also were several instances that during the game, you would see Gabbert motioning for him to do something different.
it seems that you are correct
but maybe he ran the correct route and the ball was thrown to the wrong place.
no
that is not correct. Thomas seemed to get complacent once he got his deal. He knows it.
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The truth is you can't possibly know
Some routes are made for the WR to settle into a spot and others are made for them to continue across the middle. And often, the route is dependent on a read of the defensive players.
I know this.
Thomas can’t beat man coverage against a LB or a nickel. Doesn’t matter where he is lined up. He isn’t fast, cannot read coverages, and gives up on routes. 2009 was a fluke just like 2008 was a fluke for MSW.
Thomas
the guy with 4.3 speed and the all time reception leader in the Pac can’t catch or get open against LB’s…sure
Keep in mind he played well in 09 and 2010 with Garrard.
There were two instances at the end of the games this year..
when he couldn’t separate himself from a LB
by Sylvester.The.Jaguar.fan on Feb 1, 2012 6:07 PM EST up reply actions
He got saddled with a label of giving up on routes and we saw quite a few instances of it.
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Again
unless you know the play that was called, and the options he had, you have no way to know whether he gave up on the route or was settling in a zone. Clearly he and Gabbert were on different pages, but without knowing the details, you can’t say with certainty who’s fault it was.
There was a play in Which Gabbert through a pick when he was trying to hit MJD and just when he decided to throw the ball, Maurice decided to move into a different spot. That is why guys who’ve played together for a long period of time do so well… they read the same thing from the defense and react the same way to it.
I say...
…keep Shorts, still young and needs developing. Cut everybody else, and trade Thomas. Then draft 2 receivers, sign a premier receiver, a #2 receiver, and Harry Douglas to be the slot.
1. Stevie Johnson
2. Robert Meachem
3. Harry Douglas
4. Brian Quick
5. Joe Adams
6. Cecil Shorts III
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Whoa.
Glad I’m not a young NFL player on a team where you are the GM. Dear goodness.
When there is 6 receivers
one guy should atleast step up. Nobody stepped up, and Thomas stepped down.
Anyone interested in making money easy and quick on the interne, let me know through twitter or facebook(preferably facebook).
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by rhettchrystal on Jan 30, 2012 5:36 PM EST up reply actions
Step up how?
I think you’re leaving out Blaine’s woes and the inconsistency of the offensive line’s ability to hold up in pass protection when judging the receivers. No one was in position to step up really.
the blame is all around
The receivers did not step up to assist the rookie quarterback. The Pro Bowl high dollar tight end did not provide a second safety valve for the quarterback. The coach was in over his head and not ready for the job. The owner would not give extensions and the former HC did not exactly have stability or a great reputation of keeping assistants.
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by coach, I meant wide receivers coach
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Shorts is the SAME AGE as almost all of them
Hill, West, Robiskie, Price and Thomas
They all have more experience and some were drafted much higher
If you go by the stats West is the one we want
While Robiskie is 6ft3 and was drafted in round 2???
What could of happened; did.
The reason Robiskie was able to become a Jaguar
Was because he showed in Cleveland he couldn’t get open.
If he was worth his second round pick, do you think he would have found his way to Jacksonville?
by kungfuman104 on Feb 16, 2012 10:12 AM EST up reply actions
Gabert played like a rookie. We all saw his flaws
but I think the majority of us believe he will improve. But there is no excuse for the play we got from the wrs other than that they all sucked and their poor play made it even harder for Gabbert. Get rid of these guys and give Blaine a rebuild and then we can judge him. Keep Tomas because of the contract and Shorts and maybe Dillard. Everyone else is just a guy.
I don't wanna see Thomas..
But I think Thomas, Shorts, Dillard, Robiskie, and Price will be brought into camp along with the FAs and draftees and all will battle it out for their roster spot, whatever happens, I think the WR core will be much better than the embarrassment it was this season.
by Sylvester.The.Jaguar.fan on Jan 30, 2012 10:19 PM EST reply actions
I would pick
Osgood : 5 receptions, 2 drops = 28% drops
8.4yds/rec, 0TDs (Exp9, 31yrs,6ft5in, 220lb)
because he is actually good at something special teams + blocking like a tightend.
He’s also 6ft5in so useful as a red-herring dummy runner in the endzone
West because of the statistical analysis:
13 receptions 1 drop = 7.5% drops
12.5 yds/rec,1 TD (Exp2, 24yrs, 6ft1in, 214lb)
Robiskie because he’s big and was a 2nd round pick
so must have something (Exp 3, 24yrs, 6ft3in, 209lb)
Shorts because he was a rookie and a new CBA cheap one at that
2 receptions 2 drops 15yds/rec, 1 TD (Exp 1, 24yrs, 6ft, 193lb) rookie contract
9.4 yds/rec, 1 TD (Exp 3, 24yrs, 5ft9in, 198lb) big contract
Statistics and guaranteed money save him for now.
Draft or FA three more and one of the last four (West, Robiskie, Shorts and Thomas) to be cut in camp
What could of happened; did.
Robiskie
was a coaches son and supposedly polished, but he can’t get open to save his life.
West is a one trick pony right now. Who knows what he will end up being. All he’s done so far is run slants and posts. Can’t make it the league with essentially one route.
Useless WR group
Thomas & Shorts only.
Osgood/Dillard/Robiskie/West…. like why are we even TALKING about keeping these guys?
History tells us that not many quality WR's make it to free agency....
they usually resign with their teams. If their team decides they’re not good enough to keep the team let them go. Those are the WR’s we’ll be looking at during free agency. If we’re lucky we’ll get 1 decent WR in FA and we’ll get 1 or 2 in the draft. Bottom line we’re going to seeing a lot of the same names next year.
What History tells you this?
by Sylvester.The.Jaguar.fan on Jan 31, 2012 6:36 PM EST up reply actions
When has this happened?
I see quality WRs hit the market all the time
by Sylvester.The.Jaguar.fan on Jan 31, 2012 8:13 PM EST up reply actions
So no specifics? or example?
just your random thought
by Sylvester.The.Jaguar.fan on Feb 1, 2012 6:08 PM EST up reply actions
I'll throw your question back to you...
Name the WR’s with an average of 80+catches/1000+rec.yds./10TD’s who have made it to FA in the last 5 years. There may be some, but less than a handful. To be sure there was a pissed off fanbase left with that sort of screw up.
Yuck
Move Osgood to TE and keep Thomas, Dillard, West, Shorts (didn’t see enough of Price and Robiskie). That being said I only see (2) of these guys on the roster next year and Thomas isn’t a lock. I say start from scratch, what do you have to loose?
Recently watched some game tape
of Mike Thomas from early in the season, when McCown was throwing him the ball. Dude played well with McCown throwing him the ball. Was even described as being Steve Smith-esque. He also probably made the play of the game, and I forgot how useful he became in stretches as a punt returner too.
if u wanna watch footage..
watch taylor prices footage against us in the preseason..aside from blackmon he’s just as good if not better than any wr in the draft. He’ll be here next season.
by tellitlikeitistc on Feb 12, 2012 11:05 AM EST up reply actions
These guys
They really let me down. That being said I say keep shorts and thomas. Osgood stays as special teams ace, and everybody else it time to pack up.
by jager-lota on Feb 7, 2012 12:39 AM EST via mobile reply actions
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